Question for Andy,Phoenix and the rest of the Vix Team.

[vuduo123]

right, brilliant...i'll backup the data, just incase i lose the partition.

thanks again

 

[Huevos]

I think password protection would be a nightmare to implement. There are so many ways in (menu, blue button, webif, ftp, telnet) that it would be easy to get around. And if the box was really well protected it is just a case of a reflash and you're in. You need to think where you are going to store the passwords, in what format, will they be encrypted, what are you going to do if someone forgets the password, etc. And then from a developer's point of view it would be a nightmare too because everybody would have different needs. Some would want one menu locked and not another and someone else would want the opposite. Some would want to lock channels but that would just mean deleting the channel and rescanning.

From the point of view of breaking the box, I've got a 2 year old, a 7 year old, a 9 year old, a 22 year and a wife and none have managed to get the receiver in a mess.

And from the point of view of a child seeing something you don't want them to, don't have those sort of channels and if you do remove the card from the box when you are not supervising.

 

[vuduo123]

thanks for explaining huevos. I actually didn't mean full password, but simply 4-digit pin. Also i didn't mean block every single option individually, but actually moving all the advanced options under one menu option and then pin-protect that option. At the moment, if i press the blue button, i get the cam settings...these are not needed everytime, so could be placed under a locked menu option. Options like backup, restore are not needed all the time, so again these could be placed within a sub-menu.

Here is an example from the blackhole image (when a certain button is pressed):-

Current menu:
Blackhole Full Backup
Blackhole Personal Backup
Media Player
Blackhole EPG Backup
DVD Player
Timer
Information
Setup (Cannot be pin-protected)
Blackhole Shutdown

Press Blue Button:
CAM Settings

Press Green Button:
Plugins/Green Panel





New Menu:
Media Player
DVD Player
Timer
Information
Setup(PIN-PROTECTED)
|
|
|
----------Blackhole Full Backup
----------Blackhole Personal Backup
----------Blackhole EPG Backup
----------CAM Settings
----------Plugins/Green Panel

Blackhole Shutdown

 

[scruff1963]

I'm new to this forum but not to others.
Any passwords implementation like described will stop the children from playing.
But it will also make it a traders dream image.

Sorry to be cynical but I can't see any valid reason for locking the box up with passwords especially the cams and channel scanning in my opinion this is for traders to earn bigger bucks.
If the kids mess up the settings it's not exactly hard to put them back in again.

 

[Dell_XPS]

Simple just have a pin lock on the main menu, default 0000, and then have another pin code say for example 7486 that should be able to open if you forget the pass code you have changed default to.

 

[vuduo123]

@ scruff - how does pin-protecting a part of a menu, to make it more child-friendly, suddenly make it any better for traders? Thats just ridiculous.

@ dell - agreed mate. just a basic pin system...remember, its mainly to stop accidental change of settings, not exactly creating 256bit AES or Blowfish pin, lol

 

[Stanman]

I think password protection would be a nightmare to implement. There are so many ways in (menu, blue button, webif, ftp, telnet) that it would be easy to get around. And if the box was really well protected it is just a case of a reflash and you're in. You need to think where you are going to store the passwords, in what format, will they be encrypted, what are you going to do if someone forgets the password, etc. And then from a developer's point of view it would be a nightmare too because everybody would have different needs. Some would want one menu locked and not another and someone else would want the opposite. Some would want to lock channels but that would just mean deleting the channel and rescanning.

From the point of view of breaking the box, I've got a 2 year old, a 7 year old, a 9 year old, a 22 year and a wife and none have managed to get the receiver in a mess.

And from the point of view of a child seeing something you don't want them to, don't have those sort of channels and if you do remove the card from the box when you are not supervising.

Same here mate, 3, 5, 9 and 12. I am surprised at the 3 year old who can use the box with a Harmony remote and not once had any crashes or other issues. :thumbsup:

 

[Stanman]

@ scruff - how does pin-protecting a part of a menu, to make it more child-friendly, suddenly make it any better for traders? Thats just ridiculous.

@ dell - agreed mate. just a basic pin system...remember, its mainly to stop accidental change of settings, not exactly creating 256bit AES or Blowfish pin, lol

I think he is thinking of payserver and how they password protect telnet / ftp when selling boxes and could use the same to lockdown certain areas of the menu.

 

[vuduo123]

everyone's kids are different mate...all i'm saying is rather than have a pin to block channels, add a pin for the menu options too...thats it.

 

[scruff1963]

technomate make an sr image for traders and you can't do anything except watch tv, if you want to scan, setup a cam for your sky card or anything else you have to pay.

Make a backup if the kids kill the box reflash.

If you had a dbox2 for a while then you will know the 1st general release image to give the option to switch off menu's was dw 1.5 and it could not be password protected specifically to stop traders, unfortunately the tuxbox boys modified the code to add password protection for each menu imho a big step backwards, I can understand the need to hide menu's from the kids but the password is for me just a traders trick.

 

[Dell_XPS]

I can understand if you guys don't want to incorporate the idea into the image, maybe someone can develop a plugin to use ?, that way it can be installed by anybody that needs it
Just my 2pence worth.

 

[vuduo123]

Well said dell...if adding a pin directly to an image is such a problem, then a plugin could solve this.

 

[mickbrush]

well my kids have never messed my box up which is more than I can say for the Mrs. This request has traders writen allover it if you want a trader friendly image get yourselfs over to a technomate forum its only a mater of time before a locked TM Twin image apears.

 

[vuduo123]

Sorry mick, but i disagree that this request has traders written all over it. I'm not a trader, but simply a parent, whom has had this problem and to be honest i'm a bit sick and tired of all the comments "oh well my kids have never messed my box up". If an image is pin locked, it can still be erased and replaced with a new image anyway, so really there isn't an issue, but your making it into one.

As Dell said before...if locking down an image is going to be such an issue due to traders, then why not release a plugin that allows users to add a pin if they wish?

 

[Larry-G]

The whole point of forums is to discuss and put ones point of view across, which every one has a rite to. I personally can see both points of view and both have their valid points as well as their pit falls.

 

[Dell_XPS]

I'm def not a trader, just don't trust anybody else with the remote, there push button happy in my house...lol

 

[vuduo123]

i agree with you pheonix, but you can understand my frustration...this thread was simply about adding basic pin protection to stop someone by accident, messing up a setting, but i feel its turning into a "oh he's a trader" campaign and is now 4 pages long, without any actual interest in solving a common issue.

Every kid/adult is different..some will know not to touch settings, some will by accident mess up settings and some will deliberately mess up the settings...please stop comparing your kids with mine.

I still say that dell's idea is the best....if you have an issue integrating a pin into the image, then why not create a plugin that allows a user to manually add a pin to the menu...this way the choice is of a user and not a trader.

PS. Kids have just now by accident pressed the "blue button" and messed with the cam settings

 

[Larry-G]

i agree with you pheonix, but you can understand my frustration...this thread was simply about adding basic pin protection to stop someone by accident, messing up a setting, but i feel its turning into a "oh he's a trader" campaign and is now 4 pages long, without any actual interest in solving a common issue.

Yes i do understand your frustration but as i said this is a public forum and as such people will comment and put their own opinions across whether you agree with them or not, thats how forums work.

Every kid/adult is different..some will know not to touch settings, some will by accident mess up settings and some will deliberately mess up the settings...please stop comparing your kids with mine.

well i have no kids so i cant very well compare them to yours LOL but i do have a young niece and nephew who are taught not to play with things they should not.

I still say that dell's idea is the best....if you have an issue integrating a pin into the image, then why not create a plugin that allows a user to manually add a pin to the menu...this way the choice is of a user and not a trader.

PS. Kids have just now by accident pressed the "blue button" and messed with the cam settings

as i pointed out i am not a coder and to be honest i have no idea just how easy or hard such a task would be. I will point out though that if it were a simple thing to implement it would surely have been done before now on some image or other.

 

[vuduo123]

if it can be done on old dbox2 neutrino images (which are linux based), then i'm sure it can also be done on these too...they already have pin protection...but that only stops prying eyes from say the adult channels...move that pin system to "advanced menu options" and you've got a winning formula.

oh i just had another idea.

is it possible they could create a lockable the menu, but rather than have a pin, a user could press a certain combination of buttons, to lock/unlock it? :thumbsup:

 

[Huevos]

Well said dell...if adding a pin directly to an image is such a problem, then a plugin could solve this.

You can't do this with a plugin. A plugin is something additional. If you draw a parallel between a house and the image, a plugin is like a dish washer, a television, or something to put on the mantlepiece. If you want to raise the security you have to modify the house itself (change doors, windows, locks, add bars, etc), just adding a new dishwasher (even if it has a child lock on it) is not going to make the house more secure.